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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.04 19:38:00 -
[1] - Quote
would a 4 launcher 50% th/kin missile damage 12 drone(500%) rattlesnake really be more OP then the vindicator or bhaalgorn?
personally id be fine with only having the bonus apply to heavys then
edit: ive seen many people not understand that the rattlers new drone bonuses give it the same heavy drone dps and HP as it does currently 
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.05 02:05:00 -
[2] - Quote
I like it better then the OP
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.05 05:58:00 -
[3] - Quote
with the vindicator being fine with its 90% web being able to fully apply ~1500dps to everything within web range
a rattler with the same bonuses as the gila (4 50% bonus launchers 500% to drones) with 2200 paperdps (t2) should be fine too
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.05 07:21:00 -
[4] - Quote
Tyberius Franklin wrote:Arthur Aihaken wrote:My damage numbers are off then. A single Gecko with V skills and four Faction DDA's should deliver somewhere around 1250 dps. Five T2 RHMLs with Fury ammunition, V skills, Faction BCUs and two +5 implants should deal around 600 dps. That's 1850 dps. I was also off on my EHP by about 25%, so the Geckos will be over 40k (probably closer to 45k). With four DNC's and the upcoming changes to heavy drone velocity, the Gecko should top out somewhere around 7500 m/sec. This thing is going to be a monsterGǪ I still want a second Gecko on my Rattlesnake, though. Is that wrong?  The number for the Gecko seems high unless I'm missing a multiplier. Assuming faction DDA'a @ +25% (if we have real numbers and I missed them feel free to correct me) I'm coming up with ~860DPS. (Damage types*(Base Damage*Damage mod)*(Drone Interfacing bonus)*(Heavy drone op bonus)*(ship bonus))/(ROF) (4(32*2.05)(1.5)(1.25)(3.75))/4 = 461.25 DPS 461.25*1.86(approx cumulative bonus for 4 25% DDA's) = 858.134 DPS
you far failed the approx =O (128*2,05*1,25*1,5*3,75*1,6262114)/4 750dps with 4 t2 DDAs
= 0,5^ ( ( (x-1) / 2,22292081 ) ^2 ) is the stacking penalty formula
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.05 07:34:00 -
[5] - Quote
yeah sorry just putting the cumulated number in doesn't work
(128*2,05*1,25*1,5*3,75*1,23*1,1998976*1,1312341*1,0650797)/4 820dps  <--
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.05 07:45:00 -
[6] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:
You just turned it into a tanky shield domi again that has fewer options than the one we are getting.
if ccp didn't want that the gila would have 5 launchers too instead
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.09 21:26:00 -
[7] - Quote
RATTLESNAKE
Gallente Battleship Bonus:
10% bonus to kinetic and thermal missile damage (was 10% drone damage and hitpoints)
Caldari Battleship Bonus:
4% bonus to all shield resistances
Role Bonus:
400% bonus to heavy and sentry drone damage and hitpoints (was 50% bonus to Cruise missile and Torpedo max velocity)
(2+400%=10 effective drones)
Slot layout: 6H, 7M, 6L; 0 turrets, 4 launchers(+0)
Fittings: 10000 PWG, 710 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 12750 / 8940(-358) / 9960
Capacitor (amount / recharge / cap per second) : 5350(+38) / 1154000ms / 4.59
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 94 / .128 / 99300000 / 18.45s
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 50(-75) / 175(-225)
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 75km / 100 / 7
Sensor strength: 30
Signature radius: 450(-10)
This is how the rattlesnake should be, a drone boat with missiles just like the gila and worm it gains a only 68dps over the OP version(1774 vs 1842) torp fit with ogre IIs using 6 slots for damage mods (3xDDA 3xBCU)
to those that say it's dps is too high: The vindicator does 1525dps(2MFS) and can apply almost all of it to every size of ship so 1800dps on the rattler of which probably halve is lost when shooting a cruiser are not as much as you may think
RHML you say? dps goes down to 574 from 753 cruise or 980 torp on the rattler in the OP, this is also using fury HM which do not apply full dps to cruisers either
the only thing that will actually recive 1800dps from either rattler is a target painted stationary battleship(maybe bc) or larger
dps an tank is all the current and the new rattler have so it should damn well excel at both
and since we are getting mordu's legion ships the rattler should be primarily a drone boat not a missile boat
even with 400% to drone damage the ratio is about 6 to 4 in favor of drones if it is fit with torps (1057+784)
(all dps numbers include reload time)
the drones on the rattler in the OP are not harder to kill then the drones on the current rattler or a dominix they all have 7.5 drones in HP and damage
before anyone screams
one gecko with 400% drone bonus 32559ehp btw about the ehp of your average t1 cruiser not BC or BS like some people claim
5 ogre II on a dominix the current rattler or 2 ogre II on the one in the OP have 23890ehp gecko 24419,5ehp
what you can see here is that the gecko only has marginally more ehp then 2 or 5 ogre II
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.09 23:15:00 -
[8] - Quote
Topher Basquette Dusch-shur wrote:Juin Tsukaya wrote:Crazy KSK wrote:RATTLESNAKE
Gallente Battleship Bonus:
10% bonus to kinetic and thermal missile damage (was 10% drone damage and hitpoints)
Caldari Battleship Bonus:
4% bonus to all shield resistances
Role Bonus:
400% bonus to heavy and sentry drone damage and hitpoints (was 50% bonus to Cruise missile and Torpedo max velocity)
(2+400%=10 effective drones)
Slot layout: 6H, 7M, 6L; 0 turrets, 4 launchers(+0)
Fittings: 10000 PWG, 710 CPU
Defense (shields / armor / hull) : 12750 / 8940(-358) / 9960
Capacitor (amount / recharge / cap per second) : 5350(+38) / 1154000ms / 4.59
Mobility (max velocity / agility / mass / align time): 94 / .128 / 99300000 / 18.45s
Drones (bandwidth / bay): 50(-75) / 175(-225)
Targeting (max targeting range / Scan Resolution / Max Locked targets): 75km / 100 / 7
Sensor strength: 30
Signature radius: 450(-10)
Snip
front page says 275%. where did you get 400%? 2*275 = 5.5 drones? sorry, not much of an improvement Bonus means in addition. 100%(what they do on their own)+275%(the bonus)=375% 2*375%=7.5(what is currently does) I think the 400% was meant as a counter proposal. You sniped the part where he said that this was "how the Rattlenake should be", and I do'nt want to find his quote.
Yes it's my idea of how to turn the rattler into a drone boat since right now it does more dps with missiles contrary to the worm and gila which both use drones as primary damage source .
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.10 05:52:00 -
[9] - Quote
M Key wrote:yes, yes, the new rattlesnake is absolutely terrible. How can it survive L4's with the best dps and best tank one can expect in highsec? I mean it HAS UNBONUSED LIGHT DRONES PEOPLE!!!!
Meanwhile I'll be grabbing one to fly the missile DPS and Tank of a Navy Scorp, while enjoying the drone DPS of a T1 drone battleship on the side.
Oh yah, and 3 DDA buffing your light drones is 3 DDA more than most battleships enjoy for their light drones.
Only real question is AB, MJD, or MJD + AB.
another reason the rattles dps needs to be shifted to drones stepping on other ships toes is bad
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.10 08:09:00 -
[10] - Quote
Doggy Dogwoofwoof wrote:
3x Drone Damage Amplifier II
2x Caldari Navy Ballistic Control System
the missiles do more base damage you you will get more total dps out of fitting 3BCU and 2DDA
just saying
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.10 10:14:00 -
[11] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Barton Breau wrote:baltec1 wrote:
Right so now we can drop this none argument of the rattle not being able to apply its significant firepower.
Noone has had it in the first place, we were talking about the fit. You were talking about the sig and speed which look like you were trying to say the rattle would not be applying most of its damage.There have been others throughout this thread who seem to think the rattle wont be able to apply the bulk of its damage either from cruise or heavy drones.
with all 5 skills fury cruise have 87 EXPv and 425 EXPr which means that using fury it will not do full damage to most armor BS
so in most cases you will have to shoot faction ammo which looses you 135 dps (3t2BCU)
to be able to do full damage to BCs you need to switch to precision cruise since even faction cruise loose ~150dps
against cruisers though even precision cruise do only a third of their dps(538) most due to velocity, ~180dps effective
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.10 10:46:00 -
[12] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Crazy KSK wrote:baltec1 wrote:Barton Breau wrote:baltec1 wrote:
Right so now we can drop this none argument of the rattle not being able to apply its significant firepower.
Noone has had it in the first place, we were talking about the fit. You were talking about the sig and speed which look like you were trying to say the rattle would not be applying most of its damage.There have been others throughout this thread who seem to think the rattle wont be able to apply the bulk of its damage either from cruise or heavy drones. with all 5 skills fury cruise have 87 EXPv and 425 EXPr which means that using fury it will not do full damage to most armor BS so in most cases you will have to shoot faction ammo which looses you 135 dps (3t2BCU) to be able to do full damage to BCs you need to switch to precision cruise since even faction cruise loose ~150dps against cruisers though even precision cruise do only a third of their dps(538) most due to velocity, ~180dps effective And yet the cruise raven is the most popular mission boat. You need to stop using EFT to judge ships and get some actual flying time in them to know what they will do.
just cause the majority uses it doesn't mean its the best the raven is cheap and easy to get into that's why its used a lot also its the progression from the drake which follows the same schema and most eve guides point to it as a good starting ship
the golem is a much better mission boat also mission boats fit 3 often faction target painters that alleviate the problem to a degree
a pvp rattlesnake can maybe spare one at most two slots for t2 TPs
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.10 10:59:00 -
[13] - Quote
baltec1 wrote:Quote:
just cause the majority uses it doesn't mean its the best the raven is cheap and easy to get into that's why its used a lot also its the progression from the drake which follows the same schema and most eve guides point to it as a good starting ship
the golem is a much better mission boat also mission boats fit 3 often faction target painters that alleviate the problem to a degree
a pvp rattlesnake can maybe spare one at most two slots for t2 TPs
3 faction TP? No ship needs that many, not even the subcap blapping pheonix fits that many. This is starting to look more and more like battleclinic.
its what people do when they have spare slots in their golem fits not like it hurts or anything or like they'd need to fit tank instead
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.14 22:21:00 -
[14] - Quote
Just wanted to point out that the nightmare on SISI is missing a low slot that it should have gotten as per OP
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Crazy KSK
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Posted - 2014.05.15 16:18:00 -
[15] - Quote
currently all new DDAs have the same fitting as t2 but the damage bonus is 25,8% compared to t2 23%
looking at the officer DDAs I think the new faction ones should have 20-25 cpu cost instead of 30
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